Saundarya Rajesh, the founder and president of Avtar Group, is a passionate professional and social entrepreneur. In an interview with Stimulus Magazine, she speaks about returning to the workforce after a break in her career, the motivation behind starting Avtar and what she has learned since then. She also speaks about the growing presence of Indian women professionals in various fields in the last 2-3 decades, as well as the various success journeys that her organization has helped facilitate.
Looking back, are there any indications from childhood that foreshadowed your becoming an entrepreneur?
I grew up in a joint family in Pondicherry. My father was a first-generation entrepreneur himself, in the space of pharmaceuticals, running a venture called Ambrosa. Coming from very humble conditions, my father was ambitious, driven and wanted to make a difference to both his own life as well as that of people around him. I grew up watching Appa manage the ebbs and flows of business, motivate his production team and his sales team, put together marketing collaterals, create new products and so on. During times when the business was tough and money was slow in coming, we children would be apprised of the situation and informed that we might not be celebrating birthdays or festivals that year. The entrance hall of our house was like a small conference room where he would hold discussions long into the night. He created deep aspirations in everyone whose life he touched. Till he decided to retire and sell the business, Appa gave his all to it. For me, dreaming big and deciding to go after impossible goals is an expected thing because I have seen my Appa do it.
You are known as having pioneered diversity and inclusion in India. From where did you get the inspiration for this?
The seed for any social entrepreneurship venture is to correct an anomaly, level up an inequity. It is about providing a certain set of enablers which the beneficiaries utilise to reach equality with other members of society. In my case, I saw second-career women struggle with managing home and work, especially after returning from a break. What could be the enablers that these women (women like myself) require? Confidence, opportunities, a sensitive workplace and mentors who empower them. As we worked with more and more women, we realised that it is not just women who require such enablement – it is everyone who is disadvantaged and underrepresented. As such, we began working with first-generation graduates, differently-abled people and members of LGBTQI communities. Working with them alone is not sufficient, it is important to get organisations to build welcoming workplaces. Thus began our journey into influencing diverse and inclusive businesses.
Tell us about your first entrepreneurial venture: How did you come up with the idea and how did you start your business?
In the mid 90s, I had taken a break in my career and found that a return to the workplace was a tough proposition. Flexible working was unheard of and career breaks were considered a big stigma. Searching for work opportunities, I came across an opening for a guest lecturer at a college called MOP Vaishnav College for Women in Chennai. Here, I not only got the flexibility that I desired, but also a very empowering opportunity to research the topic of women’s careers. One such research project took me into the space of recruitment and HR. Understanding that breaks in women’s careers were a natural outcome of the way their life and responsibilities were structured, I started Avtar Career Creators on 3 December, 2000, along with Umasanker Kandaswamy, Priya Dayabaran and a few others.
Could you share an experience of how you found work for second-career women?
We had started Avtar I-Win (www.avtarwomen.com) in 2005. Within just a few days, thousands of women applied to our portal. Feeling thrilled that our gut instinct (of knowing that such a talent pool definitely existed) was right, we boldly pitched the idea of hiring second-career women to every HR leader we came across. But the initial response was hardly encouraging. Companies did not want to risk projects being given to women who had “family challenges” – meaning who could not be trusted to stay on and finish the job because they had already taken a break in their career once. We were, however, relentless in our efforts. Finally, in July 2006, Standard Chartered Bank offered us the first opportunity to hire 400-500 second career women for one of their help-desk businesses. In order to reach as many women as possible, we distributed flyers at apartment complexes, we met the PTA of several schools, we called all our friends and family to refer people they knew, we pulled out all the stops to convey this message. On the day of the walk-in interview (which was held at a large hall on the 5th floor of a hotel in Chennai), as we waited with bated breath, over 2,000 women walked in, making the first-ever recorded instance of second-career hiring a stupendous success!
Are second-career women prepared for re-entry?
Great question! In fact, one of the things we find is that women in general are less intentional about their careers, less strategic. In the case of second-career women, the break does two things – on the one hand it builds up a terrific aspiration in them to return and succeed. However, on the other hand, it has blunted some of their domain skills. As such, second-career women require support to up their game and hit the ground running. They bring a lot of passion and dedication to the table, but that alone is not sufficient – hard technical skills are needed. Plus, it is very crucial for organisations and workplaces (that seek diversity) to be understanding.
You have created the concept of ‘career intentionality’. What is this and how does this help women?
During one of our research projects, we discovered that successful men and successful women (from a corporate standpoint) don’t do very different things. They do the same things, but there are fewer women doing it. Women are not wired to be career-focused, they are taught caregiving and service orientedness, which are absolutely essential. Yet, in the workplace, a surfeit of this doesn’t help. There are other skills that have to come into play. Even when women are ambitious or assertive, the balance that is required to succeed is sometimes missing. We found that when women consistently practiced certain skills, they were able to succeed without compromising their natural behaviour. These are what we term “Career Intentionality” skills. In the past 6 years, we have trained more than 10,000 women on this. The results are amazing! We teach skills such as problem solving, emotional intelligence, design thinking and career modelling. At the end of the ICP (Intentional Career Pathing) programme, women begin to treat their lives and careers like a game of chess, not like snakes and ladders! When women become self-aware, there is no stopping them.
You have travelled to many countries and interacted with a lot of people. What do you think is special about Indian women?
Well, Indian women come from a long line of great leaders. India is a country that has adapted wonderfully to the times, and the Indian woman is a great reflection of this. In the last 2-3 decades, I find that the Indian women professional has become a powerhouse of influence. I am amazed and thrilled to witness the success journeys of many women whom we have assessed or mentored. To stay committed to manage the many responsibilities that she has to shoulder, and to do everything with grace – that is the hallmark of the Indian woman. I also find that a majority of Indian women struggle with guilt. I tell them – guilt is not a bad emotion, it is just a small alarm from your mind, built upon what you have learnt from your parents and you wish to stay conformed. But there are certain things that must change and at that time, your self-awareness will help you. All I say is - don’t feel guilty about feeling guilty!
What are the statistics on women joining the workforce after a career break in the last few years? Has the number gone up?
Based on analyses from data of employment amongst urban women, there are at least 70 lakh women on career breaks in urban India, over 48 per cent of Indian women take a career break at least once. Recent trends show that there is increasing corporate conviction in this talent pool.
As per data from the 2020 Working Mother and Avtar Best Companies for Women in India, at least 65 organisations from across industry sectors have formal second-career women recruitment programmes and 8.7 per cent of all women hires are those returning from career breaks. Over the last five years, 34,139 women on career breaks have been hired by the 100 Best Companies for Women in India, showing a sharp upsurge in corporate interest. The engagement that these organisations have with the second-career women talent pool is also very holistic, looking at up-skilling and re-skilling them for career growth. Over 55 organisations run bootcamp sessions for both technical skills and soft skills. About 59 of them admit these women into a formal network of mentors.
“The 99 Day Diversity Challenge” is a best-seller that you have authored. A very interesting name for a book about diversity. Why did you select this name?
The 99DDC is a book for diversity practitioners, diversity enthusiasts and leaders. It simplifies the concepts of diversity, equity and inclusion in simple terms, such that even a young MBA fresher would be able to understand and apply it. I chose this name because I wanted people to realize that diversity is not an esoteric, complex topic – it can be learnt and practiced within just 99 days!
With so much social momentum around women, such as the #MeToo movement and enhanced policies, have the ground realities and challenges for working mothers changed?
There is greater awareness around POSH (Prevention of Sexual Harassment) at progressive organisations, specifically in line with legislative requirements. Amongst the 2020 – Working Mother & Avtar 100 Best Companies for Women in India, 89 per cent run continual e-learning sessions for POSH awareness, 87 per cent have emergency hotline support to report instances of sexual harassment. These initiatives have been ported to their digital formats in the Covid-induced remote scenario for round-the-clock availability. As a good practice to enable women’s mobility, 42 per cent run a high-risk-zone assessment when travel for work is required and make appropriate arrangements. As many as 97 per cent of these companies offer formal mentoring to their women employees and 62 per cent offer formal career sponsorship to enable strategic career progress. To enable working mothers returning after maternity leave, 70 per cent offer formal phase-back programmes -- structured reintegration programmes for these women. The gender diversity focus in these companies does not stop with enabling women, there is also increasing intent to nurture an inclusive ecosystem – 73 per cent of organisations reported consciously nourishing a culture of allyship, 88 per cent train their managers to help champion gender inclusion.
What are the challenges you have been facing in creating diverse and inclusive workplaces?
It’s largely the mindset of people. People hold deep biases, mostly unconsciously. They are not aware that these biases could derail their own careers and impact the careers of others. Entire businesses have failed because of biases. Sometimes, leaders themselves hold biases. In such cases, the bias permeates down the organisation and becomes part of the culture. It becomes very deep-rooted at that time. Removing such biases is quite a challenge. We have to start off from the point of understanding the root cause of the biases and then become deeply self-aware. At Avtar, we conduct unconscious bias discovery sessions and people who participate emerge with a wonderful level of clarity.
What is the biggest challenge for you as an entrepreneur?
An entrepreneur, in my opinion, is like a parent. There are times when you need to be deeply passionate and protective of your idea and your business and then there are times where you must be objective. Just like how a parent must learn not to spoil their children by being too soft and yet learn to be very empathetic, in the same way, the entrepreneur too must understand where the line must be drawn – where it is right to be tough and demanding and where a little leeway is alright. This balancing act is something that every successful entrepreneur does effectively! This is something that took me a long time to learn.
Do you have any mentors?
So many! Even some who did not know they were my mentors. On a serious note, I have had a truly great mentor in my father, who was not just my spiritual guide but an inspirational role model. He was someone who aspired for great things not just for me, but for the entire team at Avtar. During our milestone anniversaries (5th and 10th), which he witnessed before his passing, Appa would urge us to dream bigger, look at inclusive growth for all and enjoy every day at work.
My husband Rajesh Venkatram is a more hands-on mentor for us. He was very instrumental in my starting Avtar, because he believed I had it in me to be a successful entrepreneur. We were batchmates at B-school and he knows my competitive spirit very well! He has conducted several strategy sessions for Avtar, helped us develop our plans from a customer perspective and has also been a real-life mirror – showing us insights about ourselves from a very outside-in method that helped us greatly in our early years.
Tell us about the Stanford Program for which you have been selected?
The Stanford Seed program is an amazing opportunity for all small and medium businesses from any vertical – FMCG, Services, Food, Pharma, Healthcare, Manpower etc to gain knowledge from successful businesses around the world. It is a year-long program, deeply subsidised, where we go through an immersive learning process. Professors from Stanford Graduate School of Business as well as facilitators from Seed’s own team, work with each business, dissecting our strengths and weaknesses and helping us understand our potential. We are given tools and frameworks which allow us to unlock hidden possibilities within our businesses. You get the opportunity to meet and interact with so many different entrepreneurs and business leaders and the diversity is magnetic! When the pandemic set in, we believed that the programme would be discontinued, but it is to the immense credit of the Seed team that they designed a virtual extension of the programme which is now in session.
How do you solve big problems as an entrepreneur?
I believe that the ability to stand tall in the face of challenges and return again and again to fight is the greatest quality of any professional. In an entrepreneur, it is the single most important quality. In my case, I have often found that when I meditate or chant, I get great clarity to understand how problems are strung together and which issue needs to be handled first in order to cut the Gordian knot. I have deep faith in the omnipresent power of God and that has helped me to manage challenges every single time.
What do you do for encouragement or to be motivated?
Music is a great motivator. I am a big big fan of the latest YouTube sensation, “Quarantine from Reality”. I admire Subhashree Thanikachalam who runs the program. After a hard day’s work, I enjoy Ilayaraja’s music and listening to unknown gems from the bygone years. I derive great strength from chanting. I am inspired by the amazing Tamil poem “Abhirami Andhadhi” written by Abhirami Bhattar of the 17th century and I find that chanting it gives me tremendous peace, an opportunity to organise my thoughts and build a mindset of acceptance and peace. I have translated this into English and it has been published by Giri Trading of Chennai.